Friday, January 29, 2010

Ladyman Survey Backs Flight Blight

It's late, but I wanted to be the first to bring you this drivel without breaking the embargo. Actually I've only just got back from the pub, otherwise I would have added it earlier as I don't give a stuff about embargoes. Needless to say, I will be putting even more resources into my campaign to unseat the dolt at the forthcoming General Election!

From: LADYMAN, Steve
Sent: Thu, 28 Jan 2010 18:26
Subject: Embargoed press release: Not to be published before 00:01 hrs 29.1.2010

3 out of 4 people in Thanet back Airport Development says survey.

A survey into Thanet attitudes, carried out by local MP Stephen Ladyman and the Labour Party, has shown 3 out of 4 people support the development of Manston Airport.

'This is an overwhelming majority in support of Airport development. Even in the areas of Ramsgate closest to the Airport, including the Nethercourt Estate, Southwood and Central Ramsgate, 60% backed the growth of the Airport' said Dr Ladyman.

The survey was carried out over twelve months and received 1501 replies. There were over 600 replies from people living in Ramsgate on the flight path and close to the Airport.

'The average newspaper opinion poll quizzes fewer than 1100 people so our survey of 1501 replies is certainly enough to give us a clear idea of local feeling.'

There was, however, a warning for Thanet Council and the Airport owners in the figures. The survey included 728 replies to a questionnaire that included questions about airport noise. Those replies showed that 50% of people are worried by aircraft noise and night flying and, among people living close to the airport, about 62% are worried. The Council and the Airport owners are currently in discussion about night flying policy.

'Many of these people are currently backing the Airport but clearly their support could easily shift if night flying grows or noise becomes more intrusive. If the Council allows too much flexibility and fails to protect the quality of local life then support for the Airport will quickly turn into opposition' concluded Dr.Ladyman.

Note to editors:

The survey included general questionnaires delivered in Ramsgate, Broadstairs, Cliftonville and Margate. 641 replies were received.

3000 detailed questionnaires were delivered in areas of Ramsgate on the flight path and near the airport and 728 people replied.

132 people completed an on-line survey

Total respondents were 1501, of which 626 replies were from people close to the airport.


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Anonymous said...

You're pissed off with Ladyman for telling the truth???

Anonymous said...

Has anyone got a copy of the survey? What questions did he ask?

It is quite easy to get the answers you want by the questions you ask - handily demonstrated by orville the duck being primed as next Thanet Tory leader on this very blog.

Anonymous said...

The result of ECR's survey got Cllr. Latchford very hot and bothered I hear.

Rushing into the Coastal thingummy conference waving a copy of YourThanet and getting very steamed up, I hear.

'Flushed and furious' was the description so well done, Dickie and YourThanet.

Anonymous said...

If he gets any more flushed he is in serious danger of exploding, and that would be more toxic material that might find its way into the aquifer.

Anonymous said...

Fair's fair, he did say that views might well change if there are more night flights and people ARE concerned over noise.

Surely you won't put your considerable support behind the Tory Ubiquitous Blonde? Bill Furness is the Lib. Dem. choice but whilst he may have worked hard in Dane Valley, he says, I don't think he's been too busy in S. Thanet. The other option is UKIP and I can't see you supporting that lot of Euro-haters.

Anonymous said...


Richard Eastcliff said...

Ooh. That's a bit shouty 9:52am! If you behaved like that in a Thanet pub, you'd probably end up getting your face rearranged!

There are a number of points here.

First, as somebody has already pointed out, this is being presented by Ladyman as a legitimate survey. It is not. It has not been conducted by an independent organisation, it has been conducted by him and his cronies, and the questions were chosen by him and his cronies.

Therefore, despite his crude attempt to lend it an air of respectability with his talk of there being 'more replies than the average newspaper opinion poll', it is no more respectable than my recent poll, which returned a duck as leader of Thanet Tories. Newspapers pay a lot of money to organisations such as MORI to conduct fair and independent polls. These organisations then select a cross section of the community to survey. The respondents to this survey were self-selecting, which as any pollster will tell you introduces bias.

Secondly, the survey actually seems to have come out, marginally, against night flights, but he's chosen to spin it the other way by saying it backs airport development. The question you have to ask yourself is 'why'? Who is pulling his strings? Has the £25,000 Ken Wills donated to his South Thanet Labour Association helped pay for this survey, perhaps?

As for the General Election and who to vote for, I'm afraid that Ladyman is a busted flush as far as I'm concerned. He represents a government that lied to Parliament and its own people over the Iraq war, and locally he represents the puppet masters who have been pulling the island's strings for far too long. He's just as bad as the Tories who run the council in that respect.

So perhaps I'll vote Lib Dem. I certainly won't be voting UKIP, but I hope plenty of Conservatives do as it'll ruin any chances of that bum-faced Etonian becoming the next PM!

Anonymous said...

Possibly another case of "Lies, damned lies and statistics"?

Anonymous said...

For a man backing the development of the airport it appears his views are at odds to his recent publicised comments in opposition to Thanet Parkway, an integral part of the airport expansion. KCC,TDC and our local MPs all appear to be on different pages, presumably fired up by different interests. I don`t think flight is a good long term bet so why push it?

Anonymous said...

have heard it on good authority that MK's schedule has changed this year with flights at both ends of the day 4 days a week.

Get prepared to be awoken before 6.30am and kept awake past 11pm children...........

Anonymous said...

I thought MK had given up the ghost?

Anonymous said...

Ladyman says:

'The survey included general questionnaires delivered in Ramsgate, Broadstairs, Cliftonville and Margate. 641 replies were received.

3000 detailed questionnaires were delivered in areas of Ramsgate on the flight path and near the airport and 728 people replied.'

So this was two different surveys? How can he combine two surveys and say the results are valid?

Michael Child said...

Richard I think the real problem here is one of years of compromises over pollution risks and our drinking water supply.

Airport expansion can’t be viewed in isolation but the effects of expansion have to be viewed in conjunction with the other developments at Manston.

By this I mean there is a finite amount of Manston that can be developed before there just isn’t enough greenfield for enough water to be collected for our essential water requirements.

Without first ascertaining just what that amount is and then planning all of the future development of Manson so that we have enough water, we are heading down a road to possible catastrophe with a blindfold on.

This information comes from me asking some senior local politicians to ask questions to senior environment agency officers and I have those answers in writing.

Should you want access to some of the background documents I consulted when looking into this issue click on the link

The bottom line here is that the noise is irritating and can partially be mitigated with things like double glazing.

Both Southern Water and the EA assure me that there are no other options the underground water reservoir is essential, so a further consideration here is that the more the airport expands the more chance there is of an accident causing fuel spillage and irreparable damage to our essential water supply.

This is really about risk management and it seems that the people taking the risks on our behalf haven’t even gone as far as obtaining proper information as to what those risks are.

As you know I am not fundamentally opposed to airport expansion, what am fundamentally opposed to is fumbling around in the dark over such an important issue.

Richard Eastcliff said...

I agree that the water problem is a serious issue, Michael.

The trouble is that we have a council that isn't prepared to 'do the right thing', and will do everything to help developers, or airport owners, make a fast buck. I do not trust this lot to have my interests - such as clean water, clean air, and a healthy environment generally - at heart. And the airport has done nothing to reassure residents, engage with their concerns, or prove that they're prepared to be good neighbours either. They seem intent on turning the place into a cargo airport by stealth.

As for double glazing being able to mitigate the noise problem, I must disagree with you there. Who's going to pay to install double glazing in all our Regency and Victorian houses? Cheap uPVC would not be acceptable in our conservation areas, it would have to be specialised, double glazed wood sash windows. The cost would be in the tens of millions. I haven't seen the council, or Infratil, offering to pay for that.

And what about our Blue Flag beaches? Are you proposing we double glaze those?

The very things people enjoy Ramsgate for would be ruined by a massive expansion of Manston. I suppose, though, as most of us would be killed off by the air and water, there wouldn't be many of us left to complain!

Anonymous said...

12.52, ladyman can do anything he likes because he is policing the survey.

Anonymous said...

As a Lib Dem member, I support Ladyman, He's right on this.

Richard Eastcliff said...

Er, no actually, he's wrong.

I presume you're the Lib Dem 'member' for Margate, so your opinion doesn't count anyway.

Anonymous said...

actually lib dem member in the east cliff ramsgate, near the Green residence

Anonymous said...

MK in trouble at Filton I hear.

Richard Eastcliff said...

Sorry Anon. Thought you might be Bignews Tony, the Lib Dems new Dane Valley wunderkind.

Well, seeing as you do live under the flightpath, please feel free to elaborate on why you're happy to have knackered old 747s flying over your house all day and night.

Anonymous said...

Because I'm a wooly headed idiot who can't think for myself ECR, why do you support the Lib Dems?

Anonymous said...

MK (not the airline) has a letter from TDC showing that Jumbos which fly in and out at night are not fined. We are left to wonder what further permissions the airport is seeking.

The only thing they aren't allowed to do at the moment is to fly the noisiest categories of freighters (e.g. DC8s and Antonovs) in and out at 03:00 in the morning. Sorry, allow me to correct myself. They are allowed to do what they like but they may have to pay a fine.

It seems to me that the only thing the airport operators want changed is to remove the fines. This being so, it seems to me that the current consultation process is flawed because the people who are being asked their opinion haven't been told the full truth (horror) of what the airport wants.

Inevitably, Ladyman's consultation suffers from the same problem. If he told people that this scenario was on the table they'd vote against it in droves.

Richard Eastcliff said...

I'm rapidly going off them, anon 7:08, now that that chippy bloke from Margate's a signed up member!

Anonymous said...

3 out of 4 people who took part in the survey supported some development of the Airport. That's nowhere near the same thing as 3 out of 4 people in Thanet.

Anonymous said...

As far as I can tell Ladyman only asked a few people and those probably had no idea of the health problems the expansion of Manston will bring, not to mention thousands of gallons of fuel which will be disgarded in mid air over peoples gardens polluting their soil and killing off their prize flowers/Veg. This expansion will cause the death of so many people in Thanet yet the politicians are prepared to let it pass, it will be the only airposrt I know where the majority of residents of Thanet will be tainted as it is too near to all the homes for expansion, you don't see homes as near to Heathrow, stanstead, Gatwick. aren't we supposed to be cutting down on the pollution level when already 4 parts of Thanet the levels are already too high and are in a danger zone.

Anonymous said...

The problem is that Thanet is run by morons. They've never bothered to study any other airports and they can't get it through their thick skulls that major expansion of Manston is a non-starter. And so we go on. Year after year of broken promise after promise. Any other use for the site would have generated more jobs and prosperity. The decision to keep it as an airport can now be seen as the worst decision for Thanet and one which has severely damaged the area. Those who have backed this white elephant should resign now. This would include both of our MPs.

Anonymous said...

Well the usual lack of constructive criticism I see every time I check on this blog. I lived under the flight path at Heathrow for eight years without all the bitching this site manages about the prospect of the tiniest fraction of the traffic. Having lived in Ramsgate now for nine years, I can't help but laugh at all the 'protect our beloved Ramsgate' sentiment. Have you tried an objective view? It's a borderline shit hole. A run down half empty high street, hoodies and yobs everywhere, decrepit buildings, the gas site, the hovis factory, old casino, pleasurama site the list goes on. The area is massively funded by the tax payer so more private ventures are required to generate more jobs and cash flow. To the joker suggesting the manston airport could have been put to better use, as what exactly? There is no shortage of development land in the area which is untouched. Empty offices and retail premises all over the place and even Westwood cross can't occupy it's units.